I think I disagree with you on this one. With obesity reaching pandemic levels internationally, I think forcing simple healthy choices is actually a great solution that helps a larger majority than those who may be stigmatized by using the escalator (for what may or may not be a visible reason to choose the escalator). At the very least it increases awareness of those healthy choices.
“Forcing simple healthy choices” completely disregards the many and varied causes of obesity.
This type of thinking reminds me of the war on drugs approach to drug abuse.
Quite obviously, the underlying causes of obesity are many and varied. The only way to resolve an “obesity pandemic” is to have more services directed at understanding an individual’s unique circumstances and helping them develop strategies to improve their health.
This sounds expensive, and doesn’t sound like an election-winning policy in 2025, but that’s where we are at.
if obesity is reaching a pandemic level, it is obviously no longer treatable with “why don’t you walk up the stairs for once, fatso?”. if a majority of people are obese it is no longer a question of lifestyle choices.
Exactly. Go to a grocery store and load up on unhealthy shit, then go back to the same store and load up on healthy shit. The price difference is insane, especially when considering shelf life.
I buy frozen vegetables mostly, but I could feed my family a whole lot cheaper on cheap TV dinners.
Now we have (at least in my part of the US) dollar generals popping up in food deserts with the lowest quality shit on the planet. In the neighborhood I grew up in, most people didn’t have cars and the nearest grocery store was 30 miles away. That community is surviving on dollar general groceries now. When I was a kid we bought brown beans and white rice in bulk and lived mostly on that. We drank powdered milk.
When my brother and I refused to eat beans and rice, my mom would color it with food coloring to get us excited. “Who wants BLUE RICE AND BEANS?!” “WE DO! WE DO!”
If we had grown up in the world today, we’d probably be struggling with obesity.
“Go to a grocery store and load up on unhealthy shit, then go back to the same store and load up on healthy shit. The price difference is insane, especially when considering shelf life.”
This intrigues me, and definitely isn’t my experience. Do the same thing in my country and you come out with a comparable amount of food, perhaps influencing the choice element I describe above.
One commentary I’ve come across about American food is that the shitty stuff is intentionally priced so cheaply as to make the good stuff seem insanely priced. My experience above suggests that this might have a grain of truth to it. If willing to share, how do you feel about this commentary (i.e., what do you think of it)?
I think it has to do with the healthier stuff having a shorter shelf life more than anything. They end up throwing a lot of it out and that probably has something to do with it being priced higher.
I can’t say for sure, that’s just a guess. The stuff that doesn’t expire for 3 or 4 years is naturally going to be a safer bet than the stuff that expires in a week.
America is huge too, and moving stuff around the country isn’t cheap.
I’m just an idiot from the middle of nowhere spending a fortune so my kids can eat healthier. We have broccoli or asparagus almost every night (mostly broccoli because I don’t buy asparagus frozen), fresh fruits, some chicken, fish, or pork, and it is insane what my grocery bill is every month. I also have a big family though. I have 4 children living at home, so there are 6 of us.
That’s super interesting. For me, healthier stuff is expensive but affordable, so buying in balance is easier. It goes bad, sure, but ppl seem gravitate to the fresh stuff? So it sells.
In my experience, long preserved foods are typically seen as like, in case “I need a meal on a Wednesday.” Just a very stark difference in experience/culture that is absolutely intriguing to me, I don’t know if I have anything valuable to add haha.
I’m Canadian so I know what you mean about moving things across the country (much of our winter veggies are Californian or Mexican).
Big family or no, that’s awesome - it’s expensive enough raising a family, so just a wholehearted good on ya! Food is hugely personal (for obvious reasons), and we’re exactly the type of idiots caught up in the chaos of making life work. Thanks for sharing and I hope you have a happy, healthy year 😊
Then we likely disagree on the cause of the obesity pandemic. In my view, obesity is a choice moderated by increasingly inactive lifestyles, high volumes of low quality food, and genetics (obviously not a choice).
Add in contributing factors of affordability, general apathy towards nutrition, ready availability of food, grabbing food for all occasions (stress/joy/boredom), and corporations (esp. major corporations; food engineering for addictiveness and flavour, rampant marketing, and low quality offerings to bolster profits and scale).
So in my view, still largely long-term lifestyle choices, with corporate influence definitely playing a part.
But you seem to think differently, what do you believe I’m not seeing?
You make a great point - the built environment is absolutely a contributor!
I would add attitude too. I know ppl who will not do a 40 minute walk, even if it’s a viable option. “Why not Uber, that’s sooo faaar” is still a choice haha
I’ve had some great conversations because of this and that there are many cultural/societal elements that I both do and don’t agree with. I’ve learned that others don’t share my opinion and I’m okay with that 😊 I hope you have a great 2025!
you list it all, but i think the things you class as “contributing factors” are more significant, because it would explain the numbers better. i just think that it’s statistically improbable that that many people would choose sedentary life. it doesn’t match with my perception of my surroundings.
a parallel: if some people have better teeth then average, it is probably because they care about their teeth. but if the majority of a community has better teeth than the rest of the country, there’s probably something in the water.
That’s fair, I can see why. My surroundings have a higher rate of knowingly sedentary behavior/wild overcomsumption, which affects my bias. I like your analogy.
I still think personal autonomy has an impact. I’m a food nerd and in my experience the average person does a terrible job of assessing energy in (ooh donut) versus energy out (one calorie is harder to burn than ppl like to admit). Hell, it took me 15 years to figure out.
So maybe not a conscious choice of a sedentary life, as much as the lack of understanding or awareness of how that unintentional choice affects them (plus all the factors we’ve discussed).
But this is just my two cents, I’m no pro lol thanks for digging into this with me 🙂
I think I disagree with you on this one. With obesity reaching pandemic levels internationally, I think forcing simple healthy choices is actually a great solution that helps a larger majority than those who may be stigmatized by using the escalator (for what may or may not be a visible reason to choose the escalator). At the very least it increases awareness of those healthy choices.
Still curious what the speech bubble says though…
Hard disagree here.
“Forcing simple healthy choices” completely disregards the many and varied causes of obesity.
This type of thinking reminds me of the war on drugs approach to drug abuse.
Quite obviously, the underlying causes of obesity are many and varied. The only way to resolve an “obesity pandemic” is to have more services directed at understanding an individual’s unique circumstances and helping them develop strategies to improve their health.
This sounds expensive, and doesn’t sound like an election-winning policy in 2025, but that’s where we are at.
if obesity is reaching a pandemic level, it is obviously no longer treatable with “why don’t you walk up the stairs for once, fatso?”. if a majority of people are obese it is no longer a question of lifestyle choices.
That’s the thing, obesity isn’t as much of a problem in Korea.
Something is working.
they also have massive problems with body image related depression.
Exactly. Go to a grocery store and load up on unhealthy shit, then go back to the same store and load up on healthy shit. The price difference is insane, especially when considering shelf life.
I buy frozen vegetables mostly, but I could feed my family a whole lot cheaper on cheap TV dinners.
Now we have (at least in my part of the US) dollar generals popping up in food deserts with the lowest quality shit on the planet. In the neighborhood I grew up in, most people didn’t have cars and the nearest grocery store was 30 miles away. That community is surviving on dollar general groceries now. When I was a kid we bought brown beans and white rice in bulk and lived mostly on that. We drank powdered milk.
When my brother and I refused to eat beans and rice, my mom would color it with food coloring to get us excited. “Who wants BLUE RICE AND BEANS?!” “WE DO! WE DO!”
If we had grown up in the world today, we’d probably be struggling with obesity.
“Go to a grocery store and load up on unhealthy shit, then go back to the same store and load up on healthy shit. The price difference is insane, especially when considering shelf life.”
This intrigues me, and definitely isn’t my experience. Do the same thing in my country and you come out with a comparable amount of food, perhaps influencing the choice element I describe above.
One commentary I’ve come across about American food is that the shitty stuff is intentionally priced so cheaply as to make the good stuff seem insanely priced. My experience above suggests that this might have a grain of truth to it. If willing to share, how do you feel about this commentary (i.e., what do you think of it)?
I think it has to do with the healthier stuff having a shorter shelf life more than anything. They end up throwing a lot of it out and that probably has something to do with it being priced higher.
I can’t say for sure, that’s just a guess. The stuff that doesn’t expire for 3 or 4 years is naturally going to be a safer bet than the stuff that expires in a week.
America is huge too, and moving stuff around the country isn’t cheap.
I’m just an idiot from the middle of nowhere spending a fortune so my kids can eat healthier. We have broccoli or asparagus almost every night (mostly broccoli because I don’t buy asparagus frozen), fresh fruits, some chicken, fish, or pork, and it is insane what my grocery bill is every month. I also have a big family though. I have 4 children living at home, so there are 6 of us.
That’s super interesting. For me, healthier stuff is expensive but affordable, so buying in balance is easier. It goes bad, sure, but ppl seem gravitate to the fresh stuff? So it sells.
In my experience, long preserved foods are typically seen as like, in case “I need a meal on a Wednesday.” Just a very stark difference in experience/culture that is absolutely intriguing to me, I don’t know if I have anything valuable to add haha.
I’m Canadian so I know what you mean about moving things across the country (much of our winter veggies are Californian or Mexican).
Big family or no, that’s awesome - it’s expensive enough raising a family, so just a wholehearted good on ya! Food is hugely personal (for obvious reasons), and we’re exactly the type of idiots caught up in the chaos of making life work. Thanks for sharing and I hope you have a happy, healthy year 😊
Then we likely disagree on the cause of the obesity pandemic. In my view, obesity is a choice moderated by increasingly inactive lifestyles, high volumes of low quality food, and genetics (obviously not a choice).
Add in contributing factors of affordability, general apathy towards nutrition, ready availability of food, grabbing food for all occasions (stress/joy/boredom), and corporations (esp. major corporations; food engineering for addictiveness and flavour, rampant marketing, and low quality offerings to bolster profits and scale).
So in my view, still largely long-term lifestyle choices, with corporate influence definitely playing a part.
But you seem to think differently, what do you believe I’m not seeing?
increasingly inactive lifestyle are caused by inaccessible cities, car reliance, and multiple-job wage slavery
no one just up and decides “gee whilikers im going to start having an inactive lifestyle” one day lol
You make a great point - the built environment is absolutely a contributor!
I would add attitude too. I know ppl who will not do a 40 minute walk, even if it’s a viable option. “Why not Uber, that’s sooo faaar” is still a choice haha
i wouldn’t 🙂
Haha I know!
I’ve had some great conversations because of this and that there are many cultural/societal elements that I both do and don’t agree with. I’ve learned that others don’t share my opinion and I’m okay with that 😊 I hope you have a great 2025!
you list it all, but i think the things you class as “contributing factors” are more significant, because it would explain the numbers better. i just think that it’s statistically improbable that that many people would choose sedentary life. it doesn’t match with my perception of my surroundings.
a parallel: if some people have better teeth then average, it is probably because they care about their teeth. but if the majority of a community has better teeth than the rest of the country, there’s probably something in the water.
That’s fair, I can see why. My surroundings have a higher rate of knowingly sedentary behavior/wild overcomsumption, which affects my bias. I like your analogy.
I still think personal autonomy has an impact. I’m a food nerd and in my experience the average person does a terrible job of assessing energy in (ooh donut) versus energy out (one calorie is harder to burn than ppl like to admit). Hell, it took me 15 years to figure out.
So maybe not a conscious choice of a sedentary life, as much as the lack of understanding or awareness of how that unintentional choice affects them (plus all the factors we’ve discussed).
But this is just my two cents, I’m no pro lol thanks for digging into this with me 🙂