It is impossible to argue with someone who responds to verifiable facts with “That’s russian propaganda.” At this point, I’m just happy they’re losing.
Even the mainstream fascist reich-wing capitalist-bootlicking NATO controllers have admitted that Russian and Chinese propaganda is almost always true.
Facts are Russian propaganda. That’s why you must reject the truth and support the forever war.
I talked about this over one dozen hours ago. Funnily enough, these are all of the same excuses that I mentioned, too. (‘It’s okay because the neo-Nazis are gone, Ukraine’s got a Jew prez, and Russia’s got neo-Nazis. Boom, case closed.’) Sigh.
They really spent three paragraphs saying “no u”.
Which I guess makes sense because that is the essence of a lot of western and colonial propaganda, and is similar to what an abuser does on an individual level. The old DARVO: Deny, Attack, Reverse Victim and Offender. Granted, in this situation, it’s a little more complicated than “victim and offender”, but that is what it’s being distilled down to here, with reality being flipped to present Ukraine as victim and Russia as offender.
Granted, in this situation, it’s a little more complicated than “victim and offender”, but that is what it’s being distilled down to here, with reality being flipped to present Ukraine as victim and Russia as offender.
I’m not sure whether I’m reading this right. Are you talking about the “offender” within the context of the post, meaning “offender” = “the one who has Nazis in their ranks” or are you talking about the “offender” within the context of the war, meaning “offender” = “the aggressor force in the ukraine/russia war”?
Ukraine is both the army with Nazis in it’s ranks, and the original aggressor in the conflict in the Donbas.
What was the Tornado battalion imprisoned for in 2017?
Basically what the other poster said, if that clears it up. And the reason I said it’s a little more complicated than “victim” and “offender” is because it’s not like Russia is a bastion of socialism motivated by a need to cleanse the world of fascists. They are anti-imperialist in practice because of their positioning in opposition to the western empire, but are also under the yoke of a post-soviet capitalist system, and their opposition to Ukraine being a NATO outpost doesn’t need to be anything more than self-defense against imperial encroachment.
It’s also more complicated from the fact that Ukraine is both a kind of “offender” at the behest of western imperialism and their most reactionary elements, and also a victim of that same imperialism taking control of it to use it as a proxy against Russia and conscripting its people into a meat grinder. The west is the one who has facilitated the creation of this situation and sabotaged peace deals along the way.
Hey if a country relies on forced conscription to win a war, maybe that country shouldn’t exist.
Can you be more specific? The USSR had “universal military service” in its constitution and considering who their enemies were I don’t fault them. Isn’t that “forced conscription?” Or, maybe you could argue that these are different times. After all, China doesn’t conscript but their tech is amazing.
I know that this manner of forced conscription is of an entirely different nature than what Ukraine does, or what Nazi Germany did, where people ended up arming children in desperation near the end of their reign.
A universal struggle for your very existence at the will of your own people and the revolution they had is what the Soviet Union went through.
This is a state-imposed “struggle for existence” galvanized by Europe and it’s handler the United States in a proxy war against another state that the U.S wants to kneecap. But I get the feeling they have, conscription for any of us would mean fighting for a bourgeois war.
I have a friend in the US and two in Russia who try to make these exact points, it’s frustrating.
