Saw someone talking about moving that reminded me to ask this. I really want to stay in the U.S. to build socialism but sometimes I fear it is past the event horizon, that things will only get more gruesome, and I want my loved ones to live.
I have not the slightest clue where I would move to. Obviously the one we all think about sometimes is China, but I know next to nothing about the language, culture, history, values etc. and don’t know how I would adjust. It also seems it would be difficult as someone with no education or marketable job skills in respected fields.
Sometimes I think about places like Cuba because it is much more familiar to me culturally, linguistically etc. but then it seems an area like that is going to get a bad hand dealt to it with climate change.
Western countries would be the most familiar, and I do think perhaps they have a greater capacity for positive change than the U.S., but this also seems like it would be moving somewhere just 5-10 years behind collapse of America. Who’s to say which of these societies will jump ship to the new world order, if any?
Sometimes I also fear people across the world slowly (and understandably) becoming vehemently anti-USian, whether the US empire dies or clings on. Many older generations across the world seem to still think very fondly of Americans and our country, but I do not think the younger generations seem as affected by the global pro-American propaganda. Perhaps this is American cynicism to think like this, but perhaps it is not too crazy to imagine an era of people hating Americans and resenting American refugees, even if we try to play the “But I hated America too!” card.
Regardless, obviously being a refugee sucks regardless if one leaves “ahead of the curve” or not. It’s not supposed to be fun to feel coerced into leaving your home to escape doom, as many a country has experienced under American brutality.
It also seems kind of impossible because moving is so expensive, although I understand that if the situation becomes truly dire many Middle Easterners and Latin Americans in the last half century have managed to make grand treks with little to no possessions…although of course, many then end up in terrible situations.
What about you all? What are your situations, considerations, predictions, and interest regarding this topic?
I wish I could move to any of the AES countries, but I don’t think I’ll find any work (currently in tech field, though I don’t mind learning medicine) in those countries1; thus making it very unlikely for me to even get citizenship.
Not only that, my tutor has said their friend left for China to study; and was forced to come back to the country once they got their Masters’ Degree. Unlike in the West where apparently they don’t force you to leave as soon as you get your degree.
So, hopefully for now, my best bet is western countries.
Why do I wish to leave my country? Well… I wish to start a new life, from the start. I don’t wish to live a double life my whole life… But gonna be honest, I’m getting pretty hopeless about it these days… Due to rising costs, reactionary ideologues gaining popularity and a chance for the Western World to fall into civil war…
EDIT:1 likely due to locals/lucky immigrants already having those jobs in the country
Western countries do expel international students after their studies. Graduates can extend their visa for a limited time. But that gives them a few months to find a very well-paying job. If they can’t find one, they get deported and may never be able to return. They also the chance to leave freely, which leaves open the possiblity of coming back for holidays (possibly with restrictions on looking for work while in the country – so only pleasure visits are allowed).
This will change with the country. But I wanted to challenge the view that AES countries are stricter with immigration; the western approach doesn’t seem as strict, but it is and it’s monstrous. International graduates can’t even stay if they get married unless their spouse earns very high wages (unless the international graduate themselves gets a job – which, again, must be above the income threshold, so it can’t just be any old job).
This is not to mention how border control is outsourced to educational and employment institutions. So if an immigrant has communist sympathies, they better be quiet about it. And they better be careful with trade unions because if they go on strike and the loss of wages puts them below the income threshold, they’re liable to be deported. Then there are surcharges for social welfare, which are covered by standard taxes of domestic workers, making it harder to stay even if they do secure a visa.
These are just a very few points. The west is horrible to every immigrant, even the ones who try to abide by all the rules.
Edit: typo.
So how is the immigration system with AES countries then? I’d like to know because I’d much prefer to end up in an AES country.
Why even allow a marriage visa/citizenship by marriage at that point lmao
This happens even after the immigrant in question gets citizenship or green card?
I didn’t understand what you mean here, would you like to elaborate?
I agree with you there, but it doesn’t seem like AES countries are very accessible…
I don’t know, I’m afraid. The only thing I’ve seen is political exiles like Assata Shakur, but I can’t recommend her route.
I had a quick look and it looks like the application for China costs ¥250. Then there are different routes. For business, you need thousands in a deposit account. But for work, you just need a permitted job. These tend to be jobs requiring higher qualifications or skills, but they’re not impossible jobs. Then there are other requirements if you want to stay when you retire, etc, including making a contribution to Chinese society.
But, to clarify, I have no expertise on this. My original point was only to challenge the idea that AES are stricter then the west. They may be strict, but not stricter. If anything, the strictness is of a different type. Like in China, if you spend 4 years building socialism, they’ll want to to stay. In the West, they only care about money.
Cruel and vindictive. Westerners might be able to travel the other way in some cases. Or to third countries.
(Edit: This would not be a marriage visa. The state won’t stop people from getting married, but neither will it automatically grant a spousal visa.)
It takes years to get citizenship, if it’s ever granted. In the meantime, they might acquire a permanent right to reside, but that also takes years. Citizenship and the so called permanent right to reside are regularly revoked. Usually individually, sometimes en masse. In Germany, although their website is very sanitised, they also have an option, ‘temporary suspension of deportation status’: https://www.bamf.de/SiteGlobals/Forms/Suche/EN/Expertensuche_Formular.html;jsessionid=88A11484BE7023F86C30FDD52D4489B1.intranet232?cl2Categories_Bereich=asylfluechtlingsschutz&faqId=341378&cl2Categories_Typ=faq&cl2Categories_Themen=zugangarbeitsmarkt&pageLocale=en.
Work visas are tied to the work, so if an immigrant worker goes on strike or gets ill or does anything else to violate their visas terms, the visa can be revoked.
Depending on the country, immigrant workers have to pay extra taxes. Higher taxes make it harder to meet one’s daily needs. In the UK there appears to be an extra tax to access the health system, on top of the ordinary taxes for citizens:
Some of your other questions are also answered on the FAQ page for the EU Blue Card scheme in Germany: https://www.bamf.de/SiteGlobals/Forms/Suche/EN/Expertensuche_Formular.html?cl2Categories_Bereich=migrationaufenthalt&cl2Categories_Typ=faq&cl2Categories_Themen=blauekarteeu&sortOrder=title_text_sort+asc&pageLocale=en
If western countries are your best bet then AU or NZ might be options? The cost of living is really high and they’re both ruled by complete US lapdogs (especially AU) though…
AU and NZ, you say? I was thinking more of CA and NZ due to - from what I’ve seen, being the most progressive of the five eyes countries. I say that due to it’s low racism (outside of maybe Alberta, Quebec and Saskatchewan) and pro-LGBT stance. Most trans people I’ve seen online usually end up in Canada or are Canadians themselves.
But then again, the same tutor said one of their other friends had been in Canada many years ago. That friend talked about how they lived “comfortably” in the past; and nowadays they need to hold two jobs just to make ends meet.
Also, AU just feels like the US of the east, with how reactionary it is; but then again, I suppose such is to be expected in a country started by criminals…
I wonder if European countries would be better for me… probably not though. But I’ll say that I’m astonished at the amount of people who say they would like to be in an AES country (I wish to be there myself, I’m not picking western/european countries just because I want to) expecting as if they’ll just welcome you with open arms or that a job will just fall on your lap when you enter.
Very true, NZ is slightly more independent compared to AU which continues to be at the forefront of pushing the US imperialist agenda in Asia. AU media even confronted the NZ leader and said they were SiSiPee owned just because they weren’t as fanatically involved lol. NZ does seem to be quite prone to natural disasters due to their location though.
Not sure about CA, don’t have any family/friends there to share their experiences…