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I wish I could claim to be that based
If you want to convince people to become vegan,–or even vegetarian–you need to be inviting to them. The same goes for any political or religious movement; if you actively alienate people and tell them that they aren’t welcome before they can even try to join, then they likely never will.
I was a Mormon missionary. Yeah, it’s a cult. And you know how they recruited new cult members? By being extra loving and kind to people that were considering joining (and also hiding the really weird shit, like how they believe they eventually become gods themselves). It’s called “love bombing”. Mormons are absolutely, 100% convinced that they have the only correct religion, and that all other religions are false. But they will be your best friend ever while they’re trying to lure you in.
Vegans could learn from this.
Do me a favour: Construct a form of activism so good it turns you vegan, then tell us about it.
Otherwise whatever ideas you have don’t seem to actually work on you either huh?
Start by not making it appear to be activism.
Start by presenting options that are as appealing as options that have animal products and cost less than animal products. Make equivalents that have similar flavors and textures so that people aren’t experiencing a significant shift when they’re eating, because food is often very emotional for people. (…Which you demonstrate so aptly in your activism against animals as food; it’s an emotional issue for you, even if it has intellectual aspects.) You need to create conditions such that people can eat less meat, and titer down their consumption, without attempting to shame them while they reduce their consumption.
There’s a restaurant in Atlanta that I highly recommend called La Semilla; they do Cuban food, and the entire restaurant is vegan. They understand that if you want most people to even consider being vegan, they have to be presented with food that looks, smells, and tastes appealing, and it must be presented in a welcoming atmosphere. They aren’t loud or angry in their message; they’re doing good food and being a good example. Every meal that a non-vegan eats there is one less meal made with animal products, and that, sir, is progress. And it’s more progress than they’d see if they told everyone that wasn’t already a vegan to fuck off and get the fuck out of their restaurant.
This is the most reddit thing I’ve read this year.
“Sir” lmfao.
Apparently you’ve been exposed to some restaurant that didn’t make you vegan so we should all do that which will continue not making people vegan.
That’ll save the billions and billions of innocent earthlings! Good job, you selfish, lazy, arrogant cretin. I’m so glad the world is full of people who will change when it requires no effort!
what’s your problem?
Every year around a trillion sentient beings live and die in horror. This happens in the vast majority of cases because people want to feel slightly more pleasure than they think they would feel if they ate beans.
Each one of these lives is a unique and beautiful thing, no more or less special than you or I. A brilliant, shining negation of the vast empty silence of the universe.
But chucklefuck here is more concerned about convenience than morality.
That’s my problem.
hey you just spoke your truth and people are downvoting you and i just want to say that’s fucked up. i asked a question and you clearly put thought and effort into your response. i mean you called the guy a chucklefuck, but tbh that’s a silly enough insult as to be taken entirely in jest, no prob.
idk it just feels like you’re being needlessly dunked on, this is the stupidest aspect of internet discourse.
Lol it doesn’t matter. Do gooder derogation is a well studied phenomena. It’s generally more important to people to protect their image of themselves as a good person than to actually be one by their own values.
We’ve all gotten frustrated at that person trying to get us to use guppy bags to filter plastics from clothing in the wash, or who was an early mover on reusable bags or whatever. Shit a lot of people probably simultaneously hate on people that leave dog poo behind while also having not gone back to pick up after their pets that time they left bags at home.
Almost everyone loves animals and hates people that hurt them for pleasure, but then goes and hurts them for pleasure. That’s a fucking painful truth, it sucks to realise you’re not fundamentally different from some horrible trophy hunter or whatever. It hurts to realise that the chicken you’re eating has emotions just as vivid and real as that dog you love to pat on your walk to the bus stop.
Much easier to just hate on the people doing something different than to acknowledge it’s not too difficult to change and having to look deep into yourself and ask some hard questions. Invent a cartoon where they’re all self righteous do-gooders, probably rich and privileged with no notion of the real world. Then why listen? they are the enemy and the enemy is wrong.
The truth is we all have blood on our hands, almost nobody was done the service of being raised vegan. I’ve loaded chickens up on a truck and sent them off to die thirsty and confused myself. We’re just the ones that chose to stop killing, because some fucking hero spent their energy and sanity making sure we couldn’t look away from the horror.
Sorry if our jokes are too acerbic for you, but absolutely nobody is making carnist come in to a circlejerk and make arses of themselves because they found a fragment of the fragment of the world that doesn’t cater to them.
Earthlings lol Also didn’t you use “sir” in another comment on this post? Take your fingers off your keyboard thanks.
Yes earthings, we are all the earthlings. We come from earth, we share a common heritage.
Cite me if I did you shiver looking for a spine to run up.
Wow, this community is a great place to find people for the block list!
Yeah, the carnists really crawl out of the woodwork broadcasting their disregard of rules, norms, and context in order to try feel superior to people enjoying a short break from them.
Every meal that a non-vegan eats there is one less meal made with animal products
Missed that part, did we?
That will surely save them all!
you don’t get it do you? You aren’t even vegan and you think you know how to do it all. You are so selfish and self absorbed, their lives aren’t real to you.
I think I know marketing better than you, yes. Because that’s the industry that I work in. Marketing is all about persuasion, and bluntly, vegans like you do a really shitty job at marketing the idea of being vegan, and a shitty job of persuading people to be vegan. Shame and guilt don’t sell a product or an idea; they cause resentment.
You’re acting like the Westboro Baptist Church; you’re telling everyone that isn’t already in your group how awful they are, and using the most offensive terms you can come up with to do so. Just like the WBC, you’re absolutely convinced that your way is the only morally correct way. But you aren’t actually bringing people to your moral cause; you’re pushing them away. If you want to push people away so that you can feel self-righteous, then sure, keep doing what you’re doing.
…But if you want to persuade people, if you actually want people to change, then maybe look into what actually works.
If you cared about helping veganism you would be vegan /shrug
Are you vegan?
It’s always the non-vegans that know best how to get people to become vegan, lol
Almost like the people being sold something are telling the sellers exactly what they want to see. I wish selling stuff was always that easy.
Then the people here either already know what the morally correct thing to do is and are choosing not to because someone on the Internet wasn’t nice to them, making them a terrible person, or they don’t think murder and torture are bad things when done to other creatures and no amount of Internet niceties will teach them otherwise, also making them a terrible person.
Nobody is selling anything. Make a moral decision or go away.
You’re pushing an ideology. You want people to get on board for those. By the powers of synonyms, you could just as easily say you’re selling an ideology and you want people to buy in.
Reframe it in a moral or ethical framework all you want. Throw sticks, call people monsters, whatever. You’re pushing a viewpoint you want people to accept. Maybe listen to the people you’re trying to talk to when they tell you how they want to be engaged with.
This is a circle jerk community for vegans. Nobody wants to teach a bunch of adult babies how not to be a shitheel, you’re supposed to already know to participate.
Stop violating instance rules and go away. I’m sorry you aren’t getting your hand held.
The only instance rule I seem to be violating is not personally being a vegan. If shit hits all, you HAVE to expect some outsiders to pop up in your community. You don’t want them there, don’t keep engaging with them.
That’s aight, though, I’ll see myself out. I’d rather hang with people who can engage in an actual conversation instead of getting their feelings hurt at some animosity.
Close your instance and we’ll stop wandering in the front door.
When vegans can’t sell the idea of being vegan to people–with the exception of selling it to people that are already inclined that way–maybe, just maybe, they should look at their sales techniques. Think about street corner preachers that use a megaphone to tell everyone that they’re going to hell because they’re fags, whores, sodomites, trannies, baby killers, whatever slur you want to use; have they ever, even once, managed to make you consider that maybe being an evangelical Christian was right for you?
Directing slurs at people that aren’t vegan isn’t going to convince people you’re right; it’s going to make people hostile and defensive. You’re creating an in-group and an out-group; you’re reinforcing your own status as a member of the in-group, while being exclusionary of everyone that is not already part of that group, or is not sufficiently committed to that group. It’s not even effective as form of negging, because negging has to be subtle.
If you want to sell ideas to people, you need to take advice from people that successfully sell ideas from people. If you don’t, well, good luck, 'cuz your gonna need it.
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“They accidentally used regular milk in my latte instead of oat milk, and I didn’t want to waste it and force them remake it.”
Online vegans: #ABUSER ANIMAL-RAPIST!!!
Never heard the term before, thanks for the user name inspiration; this shit is metal!
That was my thought, lol.
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We have a Veganism is militant and a Veganism must be nice here.
A discord server Im in is mostly vegan, exactly the same response. They genuinely believe being militant and alienating will actually work in the long run. Cant fix stupid
I doubt it’s a genuine belief that it will work, to be honest. People just love to feel superior. I’m convinced the hostile vegans have joined the cause simply because they found a club to make them feel superior over others in much the same way radically religious types use that cause to do the same. They believe with such vigor because they need to for their own sense of self-worth rather than because they actually believe in the cause. If they really believed in the cause then they’d be welcoming of new members. They’re not welcoming and downright hostile to new members because that would expand the in-group and shrink the out-group they get to feel superior over.
Did it more ham than good though?
I assume they mean harm as in reinforcing the “snobbish” stereotype that vegans are known for, and OP’s screenshot demonstrates the same thing- potentially turning people away from considering the diet themselves.
You’re helping the planet and animals by not eating them, but if your snobbery turns 10 people off from adopting that diet, then I’d say you’ve hypothetically done more harm than good too lol
Quit hamming it up
I think they meant ham as a pun.
Jim is literally hitler.
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Sir, this is a circlejerk
This would sure bother them if they could read!
Wow a omnivore who can’t form a sentence without mentioning bacon, haven’t seen one of those before.
It’s a special category of food for them. They don’t even consider it meat. It’s some sort of icon. To be fair, I have witnessed a pair of vegans fawn over carob chips in exactly the same way. I’d love it if we could eat rationally without the fetishizing.
No you haven’t, carob chips suck
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Vegan food can taste really good. I don’t fucking care if its vegan. I eat stuff because it tastes good.
“deliciousvore”
Wasted food drives me nuts
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Anyone who pays for animals to be killed for their pleasure is an animal abuser and a piece of shit.
What if I don’t enjoy it but still pay for it anyway?
Well that’s just senseless violence
Okay, but why would you do that? If you don’t like it, don’t put it in your face.
oh yeah, tell me how disgusting I am for eating a poor little piggy 😳
The pig was likely gassed or shot to death. Its body was then cut in half with a large saw, then hung on a conveyor to be dismembered.
Okay, real talk, I don’t really care what they do to the animals after they’re dead, as long as it’s hygienic.
The real problem is how they are treated during their lives, and how they’re killed. There are farms ranging from pretty bad to “absolutely horrible hellish shit you wouldn’t believe” bad.
Okay, real talk, there’s no ethical way to kill someone who’s done nothing to you and didn’t want to die.
We should therefore be farming boomers instead. Gimme those daddy steaks
Good thing a pig isn’t someone.
I agree, but we don’t like to use pig as a slang term for police here. Do better.
Fuck, I’ve called cops pigs, I don’t get your point.
Are you saying pigs should have guns or that we should eat cops. I’m honestly down for either.
Why?
Because pig is not person…
Animals aren’t people wtf.
Livestock animals deserve far better than they get, but comparing their lives to humans is absurd
Neither are conservatives, but I’m not about to slaughter them and fry them up.
Ah Lemmy, just rattling off casual murder
Of course animals aren’t people. Some animals are cool.
Yeah, and taste awesome with BBQ sauce!
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Awwwwwww, thank you! I’m glad you think I’m adorable 😊
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right in the plant feels
Careful, you’ll trigger the “you can’t prove plants can’t feel pain” cascade. It’s a very annoying subroutine.
The best part is that farming animals kills more plants than just eating them directly
Actually you have me convinced now, gonna go chow down on a cow. I fucking hate plants 😡🌲🔪
Thank God it’s shot to death, it would be really awkward if it was just wounded
Tell me more why that would be awkward.
Even a wounded animal is going to respond physically to the sound of a saw. Then you have to consider what will happen when the half dead body of a 900lb pig is placed on a cold steel plate and slowly pushed into a sharp fast moving band saw. A half alive pig would take a few people to hold it down and get the job done.
If you go ass first, damn things would probably kick and scream for a good 5 minutes before it would succumb to the injuries. Would be better to go head first really.
On second thought, for the health of the consumer, the food meat animal would need to be gutted before it was cut on the band saw. Yeah, gutting a half living meat sack would be much harder than a dead one. Very awkward. Maybe if it were dead enough it might even live for an extra few minutes. One might say that would be an advantage over being killed instantly with a bolt to the skull. You had a few more minutes of life, no matter how painful they might have been.
Paralysed maybe, not able to move our scream. A soft gloved hand stroking the skin. A cold, sharp pinch as a gutting knife quickly penetrates your body. Just a few more seconds now. The blade expertly guided up the abdomen. The flow of warm blood flowing over the legs. A sudden feeling of coldness as the blood drains, one last breath taken. Never exhaled.
BRB! My bacon is ready.
Wait come back, I’d almost finished
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Im plenty critical of militant vegans, but thats a bit unfair. Industrial ranching is a big contributor to climate change, theres a well-reasoned argument I see alot
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I mean the difference is that concrete has a function and is largely irreplaceable. The argument most vegans make is that animals are not functionally needed in order to fulfill the “food” requirement of living. Concrete is, by large, used for houses and structures which provide shelter, and there are no viable alternatives.
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For sure, but that applies to literally everything - decarbonization of the energy grid/moving away from gas is a huge factor for literally every aspect of life, particularly farming and red meat. The energy involved in creating meat is significantly higher than any other foods, which is why I disagreed with your point. We have an alternative for meat, but there isnt one for concrete. Using it as a comparison is a poor argument.
Arguing that conditionally essential amino acids are not found elsewhere is a misleading argument. In addition to the fact that all of those three can be created by your body, Taurine is found in lentils, a staple of many vegan diets, seaweed can contain creatine, and carnitine can be found in trace amounts in most foods. None of them are as dense as meat, for sure, but there are numerous sources, plus supplements.
To reduce the environmental impact of food, which applies to all food and not just meat, we need to accept the idea of not having excess of everything. We don’t need 5 different cuts of meat from 3 different brands. We don’t need 5 different kinds of apples. We don’t need a whole shopping isle filled with… Goodness knows how many different kinds of cereal.
Definitely agree with this, but its probably just as hard a sell, and much less feasible to do on an individual level.
Humans need their factory meat. Even back in the stone ages
So you’re fine with hunting and small scale agriculture I take it?
I’d be fine with there being a rule that you can only kill/eat what you’ve raised yourself. No selling.
I think that would make a lot of people think twice, if the taste is worth the effort.
The problem there is people in cities could not do it, in many cities it’s illegal or not feasible to raise chickens or goats, or to hunt or even trap.
Exactly.
I don’t think most of those people are going to go for that rule, you’d likely have black market agriculture happening, and that hasn’t been working so well for drugs these days. Gonna get turkey laced with fent and shit lol. Good luck with that though!
I agree. The sooner we switch to a partial cannibalistic diet the sooner we can settle this. There, I’ve confused everyone.
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… What? Humans are made of meat. As far a I’ve read, they’re fairly delicious, too. Eating carnivores is also fine.
Now, if you’re trying to only eat the safest, most energy efficient forms of meat, don’t eat people or carnivores. But just in terms of the nutrients contained within, meat is meat.
Fuck I love having materials from other lifeforms inside of me
I might just buy hamburger tonight to spite you now lol
Wow you showed him epic style
Okay cool, have fun abusing animals out of spite. I hope you’re still able to think of yourself as a good person
Okay cool, I’m specifically going to have lamb for lunch right now, because not only is it meat, but it’s baby meat.
This is what vegans winning looks like.
Cool, have fun eating dead baby.
I did! and it was delicious, because I covered the flesh with butter from its mother!
I’m sure it made you feel like a good person
why the fuck would I care about that? it’s food. it made me feel sated and happy.
also: seasoned with vegan tears.
Vegan is more than a diet so I get their shitting response. A good reason I always used plant-based and just advocated for people to eat more veg and less meat/dairy.
Great way to go out of business.
Great way to lose your current clientele that doesn’t support murder, not attract other clientele who’d rather eat McDonald’s, and still go out of business while giving away your spine.
What are they gonna do, go to all the other Vegan joints?
Whoever they are, they’re my hero 🤩
For turning more people away from the idea of being a vegan? Me too! Less elitist jerks to deal with, yay!
Ew, imagine being vegan, no thanks. Not murdering for selfish reasons sounds awful. My pleasure is the most important thing there is, I’m not going to let some beta cuck emotion like empathy fuck that up for me.
Nah, I just mean they’re all jerks. Like the guy in the post and you. You hurt your cause more than you realize bud.
Thank goodness, vegans are the worst. I hope I’m convincing you not to go vegan with my behavior, as opposed to the behavior you think would convert you that hasn’t. We can’t lose another fragile meat eater to the rude vegan cult.
Read this exchange again and see who is fragile here. Surely you want people to eat less meat? Why would you not try to encourage that instead of behaving in this way?
Vegans aren’t the worst, assholes who behave like you and the restaurant owner are. It just so happens that an unfortunate amount of vegans are also assholes, which really makes it hard engage with you.
This is a circlejerk community for vegans.
It’s making fun of the circle jerk, that’s what these “circle jerk” communities have always been about. It’s showing the irony of someone complimenting vegan food only to be attacked and insulted because they still eat meat. The same way you are attacking people. If anything you are driving more people away from the lifestyle you want to popularize.
Lol, just keep pushing people away by being an ass then blaming everyone else. Few things you can always count on with a vegan. They’ll tell you they’re vegan, they’ll treat you poorly once they realize you aren’t one, then they’ll blame you for everything wrong in the food industry. Ugh, get a personality.
There’s a reason everyone is down voting you, and it’s not because you’re vegan. A little self reflection might do wonders.
Look at where you are posting and stop taking things so seriously. My goodness.
Lol me? You’re the one who got butt hurt that people eat meat and started to go at people.
You need to take a look in the mirror man, hard. Because me spelling it out for you just made you hand wave it away harder.
