DISCLAIMER: this is not my content that was removed, I just came across it in the modlog and found it to be absurd. If it’s not allowed, I totally understand.
Reason removed was because it’s unrelated.
Unrelated……
The guy was illegally deported without due process. And yet for some reason, suggesting so is somehow “unrelated” to a meme that is trying to say that because he is affiliated (no charges were ever filed against him for gang-related activity) with a gang, he is by default, guilty.
What’s ironic, is that the entire point of the meme is that the bullshit about him being in MS-13 is unrelated to the fact that people want accountability for this administration illegally deporting a man without due process.
This mod has definitely chosen the correct name.
And even taken into consideration that the instance is essentially a troll haven for wayward 4Chan refugees, they should still have to adhere to the rules of common sense.
The absolute bonked-zonkers thing about this is that they’ve fully memory-holed that even if this guy was undeniably part of MS-13, the group they were going after and who they had authorized this extra-judicial violence against was tren de aragua. Members of MS-13 should still, under their initial claims, not be able to be deported without trial like this.
I mean, a concerted effort to lie about known facts in a massive disinformation campaign, is unironically a reason why he is in office now. Though no way they see that context.
We have our very own r/conservative (degrogatory) now.
If they have all this evidence it should have been really easy to follow due process.
The thing is they don’t have enough for a conviction, if they had they would have used it.
I have questions and I don’t know the facts. Was he a non-citizen? Was he sentenced to prison by the US or El Salvador? My understanding is the Constitutional bar for deportation of non-citizens is pretty low, but sentencing someone to prison requires due process. Unless he wasn’t sentenced here, but there.
He was a non-citizen, but had protected status. Specifically, a judge had ruled that he could not be deported to El Salvador, which is where Trump et al. deported him to (e.g., in direct violation of a federal judicial order). The deportation proceedings had no due process at all, which is to say, he was never given a hearing after being arrested, never given a chance to speak to an attorney, etc. All of which is illegal.
You forgot to mention that the reason why the judge ruled he shouldn’t be deported to El Salvador is because a rival gang, since he was proven to be MS-13, might harm him if he was.
Yeah, no. There’s exactly zero evidence other than the say-so of Trump et al. that he was a member of MS-13, or any other gang. He was being targeted by gangs, yes, but you can be targeted for gang violence for doing things like, say, speaking out against gangs. Or not giving in to their extortion demands. My nephew was targeted by a gang because he was a witness to a drive-by shooting, and the DA compelled him to testify.
What I have heard from the other side (because I believe all news is biased so I consume as many opposing sources as I can) is that the rival gang for which he applied for asylum from, it doesn’t exist anymore. So asylum rejected I guess. I’ve only had eight days off in the last six months so I don’t have time to do real research. But I appreciate whenever I see sources for claims. I don’t believe much outside that.
What I heard is that he fled form the gang and that is why he was granted asylum. I really hate how news media works.
Where would the right place be that one might mention that ?
A conviction for what? They don’t need to convict him of anything. He was in the country illegally, self admittedly so. He was found to be a MS-13 gang member, in the country illegally, so they deported him to his home country.
He is still allowed due process. Otherwise what is stopping power from deporting people on the basis of being an “illegal”, or any other reason they conjure up? Due process is literally the method for gathering objective information about the situation to determine next steps, while allowing for a defense. It is in the constitution. And it is the only way to objectively determine truth rather than “he said she said” nonsense. We’re better than this, c’mon now.
Due process applies to even non-citizens. 14th Amendment applies to all people within the borders.
PTB in this case.
Yeah he’s one of ours? Is that implying that the Ecuadorian president is a member of MS-13? Also they don’t seem to understand that Ecuador in Venezuela are two different countries, although yeah that one doesn’t surprise me at all really
Maybe the Ecuadorian president has killed more people than ms13 and feels like an honorary member?
This is also blatant misinformation. No judge ever made a finding that he was associated with MS-13. The government asserted it in court but it’s never been proven. The immigration proceedings largely revolved around his asylum application, interview, and testimony.
So they’re lying in an attempt to make it sensational enough to bust past due process. For an example of how that looks long term, check Duterte’s regime in the Philippines. Many people were killed extrajudicially and written off as drug dealers.
The allegations that he is a member of MS-13 are completely from an unnamed confidential informer who is their sole source. The gang of cops involved in grabbing him up in the past includes a cop who was fired for misconduct.
The alleged “human trafficking” accusation comes from being pulled over while driving a van full of construction workers to a job site.
The entire case against him is built on lies and unproven allegations that would NEVER stand up in court, and I suspect that is true for nearly all the rest of them, too.
A reminder to MAGA Nazi Traitors that this issue isn’t about the character of this person, its about the abject dismissal of Due Process. If they can do it to this person, based on phoney and exagerrated allegations, then they can do the same thing to American citizens, and they eventually will. This is just practice, as well as wearing people down, so they get tired of hearing about it, and won’t get so personally invested the next time it happens.
Pretty much, yeah. It looks like they’re going on this as “evidence”
The Justice Department shared records, not previously made public, detailing how police officers in Maryland assessed Abrego Garcia was a member of the MS-13 gang during an arrest in 2019. He had no criminal history at the time, which the documents also state, and his attorneys have denied that he is a gang member.
We all know a police officer’s “assessment” doesn’t mean shit, but it seems this is what they’re working from.
The dems lost because they support fascist bullshit like the war on “MS-13” and the prison industry. And they’ll continue to support this despite the resistance of a tiny minority of politicians.
The dems are helpless to oppose policies that they support.
Are the dems in the room with you?
Rent-free in his head, all day, every day. Not sure what he’d do without the Dems to whine about.
Yeah. The post clearly has nothing at all to do with democrats, yet these people go through some insane feats of mental gymnastics to make it about whatever they are upset about that day.
Trumps crime organization removed that man’s right to due process, no one else did.
I think technocrit just likes to be a shitstirrer and bitching about the Dems is easy ragebait material. Doesn’t matter what the thread is about, gotta bait the libs somehow. Of course, now that the Dems are basically irrelevant, it rings hollow and just makes him look like one trick pony.
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Is there evidence for this?
No, there isn’t.
Don’t give them so much credit. He won because of voter suppression laws targeting groups who typically vote democrat, and general laziness from democrats resulting in low voter turnout like usual.
Both can be true
So you think the ninety one million people are lazy democrats? Not a single lazy “I refuse to vote in protest” socialist among them?
Why would a socialist ever vote for the Democrats?
Because they understand iterated game theory. (Watch the first video at https://www.cgpgrey.com/politics-in-the-animal-kingdom/ and you might understand it, too.) FPtP means you vote for the a candidate that has a chance to win. Among those candidates you pick your most preferred / least bad option.
(Other videos at that link provide alternatives to FPtP that would better represent that preferences of the populace, and some areas in the U.S. do use non-FPtP for some parts of the election process.)
game theory doesn’t determine human behavior or elections, which depend on human behavior
You’ll never change the system by complying with the system.
That’s just not true. There’s a lot of change that is incremental and comes from within.
That said, if you have enough fighting the system to do that you absolutely can’t find time to cast a vote, please do that.
And, I also agree that the system is going to be trying to change you instead, but it’s going to be trying to do that whether you “comply” or participate or not. It is possible to vote without being instantly and irrecoverably corrupted.
Because our only other option was what we have now. It was never a good trade for anyone. But take a look around and ask yourself if Kamala would have done ANY of this shit.
Hell. Just take the damage trump’s little pet gremlin Elon has done.
Think about it. There would have been no DOGE under Harris.
That alone should have been why socialists should have voted for the democrat.
Another reason is Project 2025. He TOLD them what was going to happen. In detail. So again, there was plenty of reasons to use their vote defensively.
They chose not to.
And let’s throw in the fact that this discussion and the entire comment section wouldn’t have existed under Harris. And that is because the post would have existed. And that is because it wouldn’t have happened. And that is because we would all still have a right to due process.
In the event that they, or you- need and further answers to why they should have ever voted for a democrat- I’d suggest they read the news…
… every fucking day, for the next four years.
Ah yes, the least-worst option voting tactic, which ensures only one of two corrupt, incompetent parties can ever win the Presidency. Hardly vote inspiring is it? Do better.
So in a least-worse voting situation, you’re suggesting that the ideal course of action is inaction?
Has no one told you how voting works?
Oh and by the way, this conversation is a direct violation of the rules of this community isn’t?
Your input has absolutely nothing to do with the PTB in question. Is this a “rules for thee” situation? Because you’ve removed my comments in the past for delving into the topic of the posts that were removed, so I’m just trying to understand where the goalposts are here.
Number of times Unruffled has advocated for the solution of attending any of the protests going on right now: As far as I can tell, 0
- https://ponder.cat/search?q=protest&type=All&listingType=All&creatorId=845&page=1&sort=New (also search that page for “Democrat” and “either party”)
- https://ponder.cat/search?q=50501&type=All&listingType=All&creatorId=845&page=1&sort=New
- https://ponder.cat/search?q=hands+off&type=All&listingType=All&creatorId=845&page=1&sort=New
Number of times Unruffled has advocated for the solution of not voting for Democrats: Jesus Christ I think I’m going to puke
How it works in your country you mean? Where voters have basically no say in the candidates they can vote for, and are attacked and disparaged by both major parties if they have the temerity to vote for a candidate they actually like? Sounds like a healthy “democracy” to me, sure. The whole point of a democracy is voting for folks who represent your views. If neither of the two mainstream parties reflect your views then you are completely disenfranchised under that system. Accepting the premise that only one of two parties can ever win a Presidential election means that you have already given up on democracy. Holding your nose and voting for the least worst candidate only serves to prop up the two party system in perpetuity, and ensures your views will never be represented in the future.
Plenty of those. Those people should have voted for the socialist candidates like I did! Not voting was silly. On the other hand, people are free to choose to vote or not.
That sounds like election denial. I thought you guys didn’t do that?
Wasn’t there also the slight issue of many not bothering to vote at all or not willing to vote for the more democratic candidate over Israel or something? So much drama in the states…
Yeah all those “gEnOciDe” trolls have mystically vanished since then …
I’m no anti electoralist, but people are still protesting the genocide.
There was a specific crowd pretending only democrats could have responsibility for it and that Trump could not be worse
you’re making that up.
I saw them with my own eyes.
can you show me?
No, that’s not what they said, and I still see most of those names posting around Lemmy all the time
Usually saying “toldja”, fun y enough
Either we’re not talking about the same crowd, or you need to work on your reading comprehension
I haven’t gone anywhere. Frankly you’re a piece of shit for implying everybody who cared about gaza was a foreign troll. The fact you’re entirely lacking empathy for foreigners and only care about your own sheltered ass doesn’t mean we’re all like that. Scumbag
What’s happening in palestine is blatantly abhorrent, but voting dem would have ended in a much more favourable outcome (not a good outcome, but better).
If you mean a more favorable outcome in Palestine, I… don’t think so. I mean I voted for Harris, and a mostly democratic ballot from top to bottom, but I really don’t think she would have changed the behavior of Israel in Palestine or even significantly change U.S.A. actions that support that behavior.
But, she wouldn’t have trashed our relationship with every trading partner, ruined the NIH and FDA, published military plans in the newspaper. She might have been better on trans rights, but maybe not. So, yeah a more favorable outcome overall, at least IMO.
While I wasn’t referring to Palestine specifically, I feel it would have been tangentially more preferable, but still awful for Palestine.
I think she would have been on par with biden on trans rights.
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that user is always occupying the ever-common Lemmy superposition of dunking relentlessly on people for being pro Palestine, but then if pressed will desperately act like they’re also pro Palestine and claim that it’s your responsibility to prove why they’re not.
This one you’re replying to in particular is also just a chauvinist who loves calling Russians orcs
This “superposition” tactic has a name: Motte-and-bailey argument
I don’t think those people are dunking on people for being pro-palestine, they’re dunking on them not voting because of Palestine.
Believe it or not, not everyone is a shit stain American who got to vote for one of your two shitty mainstream candidates, both of which support Israel to the hilt.
My parties? I’m Irish and all three of our major parties support palestine.
Yeah all those “gEnOciDe” trolls have mystically vanished since then …
A charitable read is that it’s only dunking on people for the electoral choices, but the racist comment history and shitty previous interactions I’ve had with this particular user is why I don’t have any charity today.
loves calling Russians orcs
Orcs : (in fantasy literature and games) a member of an imaginary race of humanlike creatures, characterized as ugly, warlike, and malevolent.
Average ‘anti-racist’ lib.
Edit: a word
38% of registered voters didn’t bother to vote. I think many of them couldn’t stomach either candidate in the fake two-party system and didn’t think a third party or independent could win so they didn’t bother. If that 38% had gotten behind a candidate like Jill Stein or a write in campaign for Bernie Sanders, they could have beaten Trump and Harris.
Preach, friend! 100 percent true!
Jill Stein was a spoiler candidate to help Trump
You do realize the Green Party has been around much longer than Trump has been involved in politics, right? Jill Stein has been running on the ticket since at least 2012. The Green party opposes everything Trump and MAGA stand for.
That’s what they’re supposed to do, doesn’t mean it’s what they do in practice.
There can be only two candidates to choose from, and both will be genocide supporters, and you will be happy you have a vote.
no she wasn’t
https://www.newsweek.com/donald-trump-says-jill-stein-favorite-politicians-1980202
https://fairvote.org/jill-stein-and-spoiler-season/
Despite this poll, the conventional wisdom remains (and most polling suggests) that Green candidates hurt Democrats more than Republicans. The parties seem to be approaching Stein’s campaign accordingly.
In addition to the ad, Democrats have hammered Stein’s candidacy in recent weeks. Conservative operatives tried to help Stein qualify for the ballot in key states to hurt Vice President Harris (just as Democrats tried to help a Constitution Party candidate to hurt former President Trump).
One thing is clear: fear and weaponization of minor-party “spoilers” is alive and well in the last days of the 2024 presidential election – except in Maine and Alaska, which use ranked choice voting to vote for president.
With ranked choice voting, neither side would have to worry about the election being “spoiled,” and voters could confidently cast their ballots for their favorite candidate instead of feeling pressured to pick the lesser of two evils.
this doesn’t prove your claim.
Wake up.
prove the claim.
No, I’m not interested in doing your homework for you. Prove I’m wrong.
There was a reason she didn’t run in 2020 and that’s because her interference wasn’t needed that year.
that’s the year I voted for Howie Hawkins. you’re just spreading a baseless conspiracy theory
It’s baseless that she didn’t run in 2020?
And if significantly less than that 38% had voted for Harris when Trump told them he would destroy America, they could have beaten Trump.
Maybe folks don’t want to vote for their own oppressors, whether the oppressor in chief is Trump or Harris? But Harris would have been less oppressive you say? Tell that to the working poor who have ballooned in numbers under both Democrats and Republicans. And tell it to the Palestinians, most of whom were killed with Biden’s bombs.
Riiiight. Yeah. Let’s all take a look around and see how we are SO much better off as a result of your inaction.
My inaction? I’m not American. And neither do I accept the pitiful attempt of Democrats to deflect blame onto everyone but themselves for their embarrassing loss to a literal moron. You lot fucked around with plutocracy and reached the endgame early. Sucks to be you I guess.
Ask yourself why Trump wasn’t put in prison for Jan 6th as soon as Biden took office. There are not two separate parties. There is a single party pretending to be two parties. They all work for the same corporations and they all take bribes from AIPAC. That’s why 38% didn’t bother to vote.
Probably because there were only a few guns found, and he sent mixed messages including telling people to be peaceful and later to go home. I’ve even seen threads here where people admit it wasn’t a real insurrection. It was less violent than things that have happened in places like Seattle - and I get that different rules apply at the Capitol - but bottom line it wasn’t a slam dunk as disqualifying him in the public’s opinion.
Revisionism
Ask for the guards’ takes on what happened instead
I have heard the guards takes and I think I have a grasp on the nature of the event. I’ve also watched tons of videos including unprompted violence and also the guards letting people in, giving no resistance at all. It was a fucked up day, but was anything I said untrue?
what are you gonna do about it?
grow up, either grab a rifle and start shooting at political candidates or vote for the lesser evil, you can’t sit in the corner and cry like a 5 year old waiting for the teacher to come and defend you.
This is the real world, nobody is gonna help you but yourself.
Yes, it is unfair, it is fucked and it is bad, but really, what are you gonna do about it?
There is no lesser evil. You either support human rights or you support tyranny, oppression and genocide. Democrats and Republicans don’t support human rights, they support corporate power which leads to tyranny, oppression and genocide. You can’t lie to me and say you care about women’s rights and reproductive freedom, for example, while providing funding and political support to exterminate women in Palestine. See how that doesn’t add up.
there are lots of other options
Chuckles the clown should be put on blast everyday.
The administration of HilariousChaos aren’t any better as they don’t have any control or want to have any control over the people in their instance.
Is it mostly traitor lunatics or just random stuff including the traitors?
The entire instance is a fucking joke in name only. I was invited to make an account there around when they started by some kid named “Alice.” I noped the fuck out the minute I saw what it was:
A shit-tier wannabe cover-band of 4Chan’s greatest hits.
They need to be found and blasted, that way no one has to deal with them anymore
Nazi instance supporting Nazis, not a shock.
PTB, clear and simple. Someday they will be mass defederated. I don’t think my instance gets them, but I haven’t been looking for more digital self harm by reading Nazis advocating for my kind to be removed.
I don’t think my instance gets them
We do. 👍
Damn. Well, still glad I didn’t go looking for them.
PTB, clear and simple.
Agreed wholeheartedly.
Someday they will be mass defederated.
One can dream.
“He’s MS-13!” Prove it in court then. Fuck me I’m tired of Americans being 100% wrong about everything and then trying to sound adult by having lengthy ‘debates’ about it.
Already proven in court. Twice.
Sure it has. Go on, do tell. Which court? What case? Who was the Judge?
Hilariouschaos seems to pop up a lot here lately
Idk when chuckles became a mod or admin but they’re eleventy times worse than Alice.
It’s certainly chaos but there’s a distinct lack of hilarity.
Alice is okay, just a bit overenthusiastic with niche communities.
Chuckles seems to be a completely different level
There’s a good reason for that.
Hilariouschaos and Lemmy.today tend to be known to be the conservative instances.
Hilariouschaos is one person pretending to be multiple people. Unhinged behavior
How do you know?
Half joking but it’s the vibe I get. Not sure how many actual people there are but the admin(s) definitely has multiple accounts and talks to themselves in “themed” communities. Like the Governor Chris Christie account
today is only ‘conservative’ thanks to one very prolific poster. Some of us are sane. Block ‘that’ user (and all the alts, I guess) and the community he posts in.
Hmm, I don’t know if I can do the bang within a hyperlink, so here !conservative@lemmy.today
I got into a discussion with two of the admins there. They basically have every intention to sit on their hands and do nothing at all about that troll, even though proof was brought right to their fucking doorstep.
So it seems .today is going to be his own little personal echo chamber.
That community only has one user.
mrmanager of lemmy.today is just a bartender keeping to himself
They protect Universal Monk and his alt characters even after having been given evidence. They basically chose not to bother looking into it.
I’m about ready to block the instance. Not much of value will be lost.
Nothing at all will be lost. They’ll still show up in the modlogs. That’s where I saw this idiot’s work.
I think I was banned from there for calling out one of Universal Monk’s alt characters. I still see his shit show up in the logs.
PTB.
Like, I get not wanting “political” content in your instance. But guess what, everything has a political side! And the comment is completely related to the topic at hand (Garcia being kicked by force from one dictatorship into another, with no proofs that he would be a mara).
Like, I get not wanting “political” content in your instance.
The post was more political than the comment, just saying.
It’s in a “conservatives” community, so, politics is pretty much the wheelhouse.
And even considering the source, one would think there would at least be some sense of maturity when it comes to moderating, but nope.
It’s wannabe edgelord trolling, even in the moderation/admin team.
That makes it even worse.
Yes it does.
Oh yeah, that guy is a real dipshit.
Yeah. And what’s sad is that he seems to revel in it. How fucking pathetic must one’s life be to find joy in being a massive pile of shit?
Some people are so poor that all they have in life is money.
